levels too low

[NuEra]

hey everyone, just looking for some help sorting out a problem i am having. recently, i am having trouble finding the right spot for my fader on my (mostly drum) tracks. All the processing on my drumbuss has left me with channel faders around -56db for each channel. it's so low i can't even use my sends, as they are pfl and there isn't enough juice to get to the plugins on the bus haha the other down fall is i can't really fine tune a level when the faders are that low.

its not really a serious problem and now that i am aware of it im sure i can kind of tinker when i start a new project to make sure i am getting good level on my tracks. but just wondering if anyone has run into this and what they do to find a good balance between bus compression but good levels from the individual tracks..

happy new year all

[Medway]

Sounds like something is off there, I usually have all my faders at 0.

Seems like you must be boosting the drum sub way too much. What kind of gain are you running inside of it?

[NuEra]

i put all my faders at 0 and i am much happier thanks!

[Medway]

Glad it worked out I went through a similar phase when I first started getting used to digital mixing, its so easy to get your levels out of wack but this change should help make things run smoother for you.

You really want to remove as much mental overhead as possible when mixing so it can flow easier and this is one step towards that.

[NuEra]

ok now i find i am over compensating in other ways. ..really low note velocities, dropping -20db of gain from a compressor. how 'loud' should our source tracks be?

[NuEra]

also what do you mean by mental overhead?

[Medway]

Originally Posted by NuEra

ok now i find i am over compensating in other ways. ..really low note velocities, dropping -20db of gain from a compressor. how 'loud' should our source tracks be?

Not sure what the issue is here. I usually have my velocities at default when using typical normalized drum samples.

These come in usually around 0db at unity gain so I'll then drop them down just a few db so that the master doesn't get overloaded and thats about it.

If I compress them then I'll make up any gain there as needed.

Sounds like you have some gain boosted too high somewhere that is causing this.

Take off all your plugins and start over from scratch just using the above settings. That should give you a normal amount of level with no drastic gain changes.

From there on any new pluging you add you will compensate for but these shouldnt be adding or taking away much either way.

[Medway]

Originally Posted by NuEra

also what do you mean by mental overhead?

Mental overhead refers to having to think about too many things while trying to mix. In other words you want to be able to just concentrate on the mix itself and not worry about having to compensate for all these types of gain problems or other issues that arise from the digital mix environment.

This is why I suggest people suss out their entire signal path so they know whats going on at each stage, for instance which plugins can distort or clip etc... Otherwise you end up worrying about this stuff when you should be concentrating on mixing.

[NuEra]

Ok, so I turned off all my buss processing and just ran a kick drum with the fader at 0db. It gives a nice full sound but the peaks go past 0 on the fader and make it red...ok?

Assuming the kick drum is the main anchor of the track, and the rest of the elements are mixed based on the level of the kick..approx how many Dbs rms should the kick be?

[Medway]

If there is no gain anywhere then the kick shouldn't actually be clipping. If anything the sample might already be boosted up to 0db which in some DAWs will trigger the lights but technically it should be riding right at 0.

What I would do is just take a couple of db off it and it should be fine then, if not there is still something adding gain somewhere.

I dont check rms for kicks in fact I dont check rms for anything really anymore as its not that great of an indicator of the actually 'quality' of the mix.

Peak wise though usually the kick and main snare/clap will be peaking at 0db and clipped a bit during the drum and master buss processing.

If the samples already have this type of processing applied to them then you have to adjust in your mix accordingly by maybe using less on your end.

In other words dont compress a lot an already compressed sample.

One thing I noticed when making these videos for the course (finishing the mix and master one today -- then its just a matter of cleaning them up and uploading) is how I dont even really pay attention to having to set these types of levels too much.

You'll see I dont spend a whole lot of time setting stuff up its more about just keeping the flow and getting the track finished, in other words not getting tied up into too much detail -- especially early on.

In the mix and master vids I'll fine tune things but some people might even be surprised at how 'non technical' a lot of the process is leading up to that point, if that makes sense.